Backstage Pass: From Radio to Rock Legends with Tommy

Summary

Tommy Nast, 50-year veteran of upstate New York radio, the Album Network trade magazine, Clear Channel and AEG concert promotion, and now Trafalgar Releasing's event cinema business, walks Rachel and Dave through a career built one show at a time. The standout stories: getting a wine bottle thrown at his girlfriend by Gene Simmons backstage at a KISS show in the mid-70s and badmouthing the band on air that night, only to work with them decades later on the Sonic Boom album. Plus the Black Crows hiding two giant dead fish under his Houston hotel bedcovers.

Key takeaways

1. One handshake can set the trajectory — A buddy brought Wolfman Jack into Tommy's high school. That afternoon sparked 10 years of radio in upstate New York, which opened the doors to record labels, concert promotion, and the music industry he's still in.
2. The rider is a compliance test, not a wish list — Van Halen demanded all brown M&Ms be removed from the bowl. The clause was buried on purpose. If a promoter missed that, the band knew the promoter had missed something else that mattered. The lesson lives in every rider since.
3. Getting kicked out is not the end of the relationship — Tommy charged the stage at a KISS show after Gene Simmons threw a wine bottle at his girlfriend. He badmouthed the band on the air that night. Years later he worked for them on the Sonic Boom release. The loudest moments don't have to be the permanent ones.
4. The failure on stage is the most memorable moment — Paul McCartney's mic died at Live Aid during Let It Be. Everyone ran on stage to sing with him. That's the moment people remember, not the perfect version. The save makes the show.
5. Small venues are worth protecting — Tommy's favorite show post-COVID was the Foo Fighters at the Canyon Club in Agoura Hills, a thousand-seat room with dinner. The vibe was a national-act warm-up in a room where you could see the band sweat. Show up for these venues so they survive.

Transcript

00:00 With over 33 years in the mobile bartending and service industry, he is the guy who brings the party and the joy wherever he goes. She's a seasoned event planner and producer with more than 20 years of experience in sports, corporate, nonprofit, and private events, and she's here to keep things running smoothly.

00:20 Together we are hot mics, cold drinks, and untold disasters of the wild, hilarious, and unforgettable moments in the world of events. This is the event talk podcast with Dave and Rachel. Hi, welcome to the event talk podcast, hot mics, cold drinks, and untold disasters. I'm here with Dave today and we actually have a special guest who I actually have never met, but I've heard some fun stories along the way.

00:43 We have Tommy Nast, not nasty, Nast, joining us today. And I was reading a little bit about you, Tommy, and Dave will kind of do it, but like you have been in this career in some way for a very long time and in lots of different fields, lots of different hats, and I'm excited to hear more.

01:02 I mean, I can go back 50 years in my career at this point now, but I started out on the radio in upstate New York for 10 years, moved to Los Angeles where I ran a trade magazine publication called the Album Network. We did a syndicated radio network along with that. Then went into the concert business working with Clear Channel Entertainment before it

01:28 was Live Nation and AEG, which is the second biggest concert promoter and venue owners around the world as well, and did a promotion, a marketing company in the music business promoting so many different bands and marketing a number of them. And then over the past 10 years, I've gotten into the event cinema business working with

01:54 Trafalgar Releasing where we put music events in movie theaters around the world. That's cool. I haven't ever been to one of those. I haven't either. Is that like the candlelight kind of thing? Is it a movie? It's movies. I mean, we take concert films, concert documentaries, things like that.

02:14 And when I tell you some of the things that we've done, you will probably go, Oh my gosh, I remember, I heard that. We worked with AMC on Taylor Swift and Beyonce, putting those in the theaters and we do these around the world and have worked with Metallica, Coldplay, Billie Eilish, BTS, Miley Cyrus, Tom Petty, Neil Young, Pink Floyd.

02:43 Just a few names. No big deal. Yeah. And we got a couple coming up here now too with Youngblood, who was prominently featured in the Ozzy Osbourne event a few weeks ago prior to Ozzy's passing. That's coming up. And then we have a Grateful Dead movie coming up August 4th. Wow. A lot of good stuff going.

03:05 Weren't you on Married with Children also, a little spot up there? My 15 seconds of fame there. There you go. We watched that drunk in the lobby somewhere around time. I showed that to all our hockey buds before. It was like, really? Oh my gosh. Well, and that's how you guys know each other is your kids played hockey together, right?

03:26 We did. We sure did. We were goalie dads together, which, you know, crazy as it is, but so much fun though. We had a blast with, you know, especially the parents getting together after the games when we're in tournaments all over the country. We would drive to California and I'd have a full bar in the back of the Suburban before the games, right?

03:48 And if it was a morning game, we'd have mimosas and the other teams were like, come on, come drink with us. And they'd look around like, we're playing against you. We're like, no, no, no. The kids are playing. Get over here. Let's get drunk. Now we have friends all around the world, right?

04:00 Just because we all had such a good time. It's crazy where they all ended up and everything. And Dave and I have blackmail pictures of each other too. So we do. But you know what? They're so old. It's on a little floppy disk. Unless you have a reader, you're never going to get them.

04:17 I had a Polaroid camera. You got a Polaroid? Hey, they're coming back. I just bought one of those for an event that the kids love taking pictures of the Polaroid picture. I had to find a disc reader, a USB disc reader, because I found a box of discs and some of the stuff on there.

04:31 I'm wondering why in the fuck that I even keep this shit. We do have some stuff. Well, we got pretty drunk. If any hockey parents are out there, you'll know, right? Traveling hockey. I want to hear stories, guys. Message of stories. When we're done with this, I'll bring them up. Oh, for sure.

04:45 Oh my gosh. Well, it sounds like you've had a front row seat to a lot of these really cool experiences for decades. What do you consider your big break moment that got you into what excelled your career? You know what? It's crazy, because I grew up in Rochester, New York, then moved to Los Angeles, finished

05:13 high school, and went to college out there before I moved back to Rochester to get a job on the radio, which I was lucky to do. But in high school, a buddy of mine at one point brought Wolfman Jack, legendary DJ, into our high school. Yeah. And he was like, hey, buddy, this is the Wolfman.

05:32 And it was like, wow, that was so cool. And it really sparked my love for wanting to be on the radio. And it was something that I did. And I had just a blast working on the Top 40 side, on the Rock side. And that was really what started it all. And from there, I was interacting with so many of the record executives and promotion

05:59 people that would come in and take you to dinner and buy you drinks and try to get you to play their records and add music to the radio station. And from there, that's when doors started opening, seeing how the radio business worked, how the music business worked, and how the concert business unfolded.

06:26 So it was just like I've been learning along the way. And I've dabbled into everything from artist manager and working with live events to promoting some of the biggest bands in the world that you guys may have heard of from Van Halen and the Black Crows and Bryan Adams and Rush, Bon Jovi.

06:50 I've been blessed to have worked and been a part of a lot of the great music that has painted the pictures for us all in the past. And then now, segwaying into the event cinema business has been tremendous, putting music events in movie theaters, which is the thing about that which is cool is when you go to

07:15 a cinema event like that, it's different than just going to see Superman or Fantastic Four in the movies. Because you're with your like-minded fans. You've got arguably the second best opportunity to see a band if it's not live live. And in some cases, it's even better because you're right up there.

07:41 You've got the... Exactly. And it's been tremendous with how we see fans singing, dancing. I was going to say, do they sing? Because in a movie theater, you have to be dead quiet. Don't you? No, absolutely. And so in a theater, they sing along and interact and do they jump up and down?

07:59 They do. They're singing along with it. I love it. And it's like when we did Coldplay live, Chris Martin... Great concert. Whoopi. Yeah. He didn't have the kiss cam going. Right. Not at the theater. But he called out all of the countries that we were in. And in our location in California, when he welcomed the United States, everybody was cheering and yelling.

08:24 And it's great to see the interaction with fans on that. And you talk a bit about what happens behind the scenes on there, but I mean, it's craziness getting them produced and getting the bands to do the intros, welcoming them to the theater. But it's a live concert, obviously, that they have to record in front of.

08:45 It's recorded live. It's recorded live. But we have the live live also. Oh, wow. Okay. Coldplay was... That emanated out of Sao Paulo, Brazil, I think. And that went live around the country and around the world. So it's interesting and knock on wood, we haven't had issues technically in most...

09:09 There's been times when a theater, the feed doesn't work or your internet's out or whatever way you're bringing it in. That happens. But for the most part, it's a great experience to see a concert film or a concert documentary also. Would you say that the sound in the theater helps also?

09:32 Because you have all of this around sound, which is just coming right at you. Yeah. I mean, in between with what IMAX does and what the theaters do with their special sound in there, it's incredible. The thing we do, I mean, we'll be behind the scenes and if I'm in a theater location and it's like, I don't think it's loud enough, it's like, hey, engineer, let's go crank up the volume.

09:57 Let's get this thing going more. But for the most part, they've got instructions that are pretty well into place to get the volume the right way and making sure that the fans that are in there are having a good time and interacting and just enjoying their favorite artists. Perfect.

10:17 Do you have any stories of when you were younger at some of these concerts? Where it was like a smooth appearance, but it happened fine. Don't say any names if you don't have to. You know what's so funny? Can you even remember? Yeah, but you know, I'll tell you what's always been one of the funniest things that I've always seen was, and you might remember this, and Rachel, you may be too young to remember this.

10:41 Yeah, she's a puppy. But when Van Halen was touring in the early days, they used to have their rider that was kind of a contract to all of the promoters that were doing the show, and they always made it adamant that you could not, they wanted M&Ms, but you had to take out the brown M&Ms.

11:04 The brown ones. Unfortunately, this still happens on Riders. And if you didn't do that, you know, they'd go crazy. And the reason, the funny thing is, why do they do this? They put that in to make sure that everybody read the contract, read the rider that they were doing. And, you know, because if they missed that, what else did they miss?

11:31 And so that's one of the funny behind the scenes things that, you know, I had heard about and asked about and it was explained to me why they did that, because years later it was like, and it was just hilarious and got a lot of hype out of it then too. Who was yellow M&Ms? Wasn't somebody yellow?

11:51 I feel like sometimes they put stuff on the rider thinking, oh, they're never going to fill this or fulfill this, it's just like a joke. And the people actually do. And they're like, oh shit, they actually did it. Like, yeah, no, I had one that asked for Air Force Ones to wear on stage and then it rained.

12:06 So it was too slippery. So he never wore them. So, but he took them home with him. Oh, you got a free pair of shoes. Yeah. And then another one asked for Caymus wine, which I think we got the Caymus though after the fire. I don't think they got the right beer because it was a young girl buying, you know, the Caymus and didn't understand wine or anything.

12:22 And so anyways, but yeah, she, she didn't drink it on site, but she took it back to, I'm sure the airport or not airport, but the hotel and drink it there. But some of the riders are funny. A funny kiss story too, because it's like, uh, show you some of the things behind the scenes.

12:37 I was backstage at a kiss concert in the mid seventies when they were, you know, just really getting started. And I was standing there with my girlfriend and apparently one of the roadies was checking her out. Really? You know, who's that girl over there? Oh, look at that. And he, and he missed a cue and it pissed the shit out of Gene Simmons and Gene.

13:02 There was a wine bottle on stage and Gene tossed a wine bottle and you know, it almost hit my girlfriend and I went charging up the stage to try to get at him for doing that. And we were kicked out of the concert. And funny after that, you know, I went on the air that night and dropped all the kiss music and bad mouth them on the air and told everybody what happened.

13:29 And they had to apologize and, you know, flowers and stuff to my girlfriend. Years later, um, I became great friends with the band. I actually worked for them for about a year on the release of their Sonic Boom album that came out, you know, late 2000s. Um, and you know, Gene and I joked about it and it was always fun.

13:53 Gene and Paul, just a great personalities and, and, and just fun people and great businessmen as you I'm sure know as well. I mean, they've had a very long career, so they gotta be doing something right. He remembered that bottle of wine coming at you. Oh yeah, yeah. He said he did, but you know, it was like, there's so many, there's so many things, you know, who knows if he really did or if he's just bullshitting me or what.

14:16 Right. I'd love to get a singer or somebody on this podcast talking about like things that obviously on stage are like, yeah, it comes off perfect. And then behind the scenes, something like that, there's gotta be way more things behind the scenes. No, there's, there's, there's so much that can go on between, you know, just, uh, anything that can go wrong, malfunctions of equipment or whatever, but yeah, the gear's not working,

14:41 the mic's not working, you know, and it's funny, I was just watching, um, a live aid special from back when the show happened and in the UK, uh, portion of it, the last thing that Bob Geldof did was bring Paul McCartney on and Paul got up and was doing, let it be and his mic wasn't working.

15:05 And it was like, come on, it's Paul McCartney. How do you not fit his mic in that? And then everybody came running on stage and singing along with him. That was just like, you know, something that I was looking at going, how does that happen? Yet, as you're attending the concert, seeing something like that, that should go perfect and like what they do to solve it is like the most memorable concert experience ever.

15:28 So it's like, yes, when something doesn't work, it sucks. But like, sometimes that's what the people go to the concerts for are those experiences, which is very cool. It happens more than people realize, but I'm sure it does for sure. But there's, you know, there's so many things that have happened behind the scenes in the, in the music world and, you know, going backstage before a show and seeing the guys after the

15:53 show and, you know, if they're happy, if they're pissed off about the performance, if it went great, you know, things like that, you know, it always seemed to be a positive, um, for the most part. I mean, it's live. It's real. It is. Right. That's the great thing about a concert.

16:12 You go to, you know. Absolutely. So you've worked with so many legends along the way. Do you have any stories that literally still like, make you shake, laugh and you're just like, oh my gosh, how did we, how did we, yeah, he knows, and then you've never told? Well, I mentioned like the Black Crows, um, working with them was great.

16:32 A fun, fun band. What a great rock band. And we've always affectionately called them, you know, the, the greatest, the most rock and roll rock and roll band that there is out there. And I went into, I want to say it was Houston, Texas to see a show with them and Chris Robinson, the lead singer of the band and his manager at the time, Pete Angeles and their label

17:00 head Mark DiDia, who is now the current manager of the Black Crows. They went in and got into my hotel room before I checked in and they put dead fish, like two giant dead fish under the covers at the foot of my bed. And it was, so when I checked in, it was like, oh, something's, something's weird here.

17:24 It looked a little out of place and I opened, thank God I did it when I checked in and not like getting drunk later and going into bed and they were trying to see if they could, they were trying to see if they could, you know, give me the hint of sleeping with the fishes. Oh my God.

17:40 That's nasty. That's gross. It was. What'd you do with the fish after you found them? I called room service and had them cooked up and I called the hotel. I called and then changed rooms and, you know, so it was kind of funny how that all happened. So would you say most of the bands are good practical jokers?

18:05 I mean, are most of them or are most of them more serious when they're on the road? You know what? There's both. I mean, you know, if you're, I mean, I would imagine like, you know, I haven't gotten too many experiences like backstage at a Pink Floyd concert, but I think they're a little bit more, you know, music sensitive and there's so much going on with their production and, you know, their musicianship.

18:34 But for the most part, you know, some other bands are pretty fun to hang with, you know, before that. I always, you know, got along great with, you know, Bon Jovi and Richie Samboro when they were together. They're always fun before and after the shows and that. So it was always pretty cool.

18:51 I've been doing it a long time, so it just comes natural to them. Coldplay seems like they have fun, too. Exactly. Well, yeah, I mean, it's, I mean, and that whole kiss cam thing now. Oh, my God. He called it out right then and there, too, which was even better. I mean, it was just like, oops.

19:07 Oopsies. Sorry. Didn't he say something the next concert? He said there was going to be some video going on or something? Teams like baseball teams have been doing it with like their mascots. Like everybody's been duplicating it. Talk about the meme you never wanted. That's totally out there.

19:22 Everyone's been doing it. It's crazy. Oh, my goodness. We should do it. And even like sporting events, too. I mean, when I worked at AEG, AEG owned the LA Kings, and me being the huge Kings fan that I am, it's like, you know, wow. And if you hear people screwing up national anthems in that, you know, it's like, you know, how many times that's happened.

19:46 You know, in particular, if you have an artist who is singing the Canadian national anthem along with the U.S. anthem, and they forget the words or something like that, I've seen that happen. You know, and it's like, oops, you know. Well, just like in Canada, you stop singing and let the crowd sing and bring it back, right?

20:08 Exactly. That's been the big thing there now, too, with getting the crowd singing these anthems and that. But it's always been kind of fun. You and me both. Yeah, wait. And I thought this was going to be a hockey podcast that we were doing. Dave, you pulled the wrong thing. Are you kidding me?

20:25 Next year. Geez, Dave, you know. Come on, I'm better at getting drunk and throwing parties than I am skating. You've seen me skate, so I can go straight and left. That's all I got. And I can't skate anymore. After two hip replacements in that now, my skating and playing hockey is, you know, my beer league days have come to an end a few years back.

20:45 Well, I just told her, I said, Boeing has a beer league and they keep asking Jake to play. Yeah. How do they even find out? I played goal. Yeah. The hell? He's like, no, I'm not doing it. And my son, Nick, he graduated a beer league also, and he's playing goal. He's playing out. Is he having fun?

21:06 Oh, he loves it. He and his wife, she played hockey also. So that's how they met. She was playing at St. Mary's University on the women's team and he's obviously he was playing in the men's team and they met and connected and they're still playing hockey together, which is great.

21:22 Yeah, Jake's a fisherman now in Seattle. He's all about fishing. Is a beer league is just like drinking beer while playing hockey? Some of the players do. They do, but, you know, afterwards, the boys go out for beers. Some of them used to keep it on the bench. All I can think is their water bottles that they spray into their helmets.

21:41 Nikki and Jake, we played at such a high level. These kids were 13, 14, 15, and they had nutritional guidelines. They couldn't do certain things on, you know, game days. In between, we'd have to eat specific foods. And, you know, every summer the season would end in March and then Nikki and Jake would jump on another national team and then we'd have another two months.

22:07 I think Jake said he had three weeks a year to play Legos. When you're in that, you know, competitive youth scene, it's tough to give up the summer and say, oh, no, we're going to go play baseball now. It was never like that. It was always like, let's go play hockey. I mean, 15, 16, we were at nationals.

22:29 Scouts were watching us. It was just crazy. I have a friend that's got a baseball player son and a dancer daughter, and so between the two of them, the dad goes baseball, mom goes dance. My daughter did dance also, so I know what that was like going to dance competitions and that.

22:48 Well, California, that's where everybody goes to. Watching dance moms was always a funny show. Oh, we should buy that domain. Well, no, that's already gone. That's a whole show. That's a whole series. But hockey parents next to dance parents are like night and day. I'll take the hockey parents.

23:10 Oh, absolutely. Now, I was the manager. Remember, we had a rule. You couldn't talk to the coach for 24 hours after a game, right? Then you could go. You had to calm down a little bit, take a deep breath, have a crownie. That was so funny. That was so funny. But behind the scenes at events has always been hilarious, be it sporting events, be it music events.

23:36 I mean, I'm a huge wrestling fan also. Oh, really? And so, I mean, I love like the WWE and all that they've been doing and, you know, going, you know, meeting several wrestlers over the years and working with some of them on. There's a number of them are into the music scene also, and they're recording and trying to do music stuff as well.

23:59 So I was able to get a lot of tickets to a lot of wrestling matches and seeing what goes on backstage at those also. Those have got to be crazy. But, yeah, I mean, it is because, you know, and now it's no secret, it's scripted, not saying that it's not real. And they can definitely get into pains real.

24:19 They're real athletes. They are really going through these moves and everything. But, yeah, the outcomes are predetermined and a surprise to us all. But, man, what goes on behind the scenes at those is insanity and just so cool to see. Can you give us a – Well, there's a special.

24:38 I'll tell you what the best thing to do, and I believe it's Netflix that has a new series that the WWE just released called Unreal. And it takes you behind the scenes of what's really happening. And it's causing a little controversy because, you know, some fans don't want to see what's really happening.

25:01 They want to believe it's not. But it's fantastic. I mean, it's a great thing to look at what happens behind the scenes in that world. And it would be interesting, as you guys are doing event podcasts and things that are happening on there, I mean, really, to see if there are more shows that are going to be created that will expose what happens behind the scenes.

25:28 And maybe expose is a heavy word to use for that. But, you know, what goes on behind the scenes in various types of industries on there. That's what we're hoping. We're hoping having you on, everyone's going to say, Oh, my God, Tommy's on. I want to be on. So that's the next one.

25:46 I had the WWE Bella Twins live down the street for me for a little bit. They live next to each other. And, yeah, kind of like what you said earlier on the podcast. Like, these are normal people. They have issues. They have success. They have love. They have hate. They have families.

25:58 You know, everybody has these things. So I think when you kind of like what you said, Tommy, like when you go behind the scenes of things, it's like a whole new world to a lot of people because they have this persona of who they are. Well, I used to watch Bobo Brazil and the Sheik.

26:10 You're going way back. Yeah. And roller derby was on right before it. Yeah. We had the L.A. T-Birds that we used to watch. It was on there as well. You weren't even born yet. Roller derby and hockey and wrestling. Roller derby. I was on Sunday. Every Sunday. I used to watch it every Sunday.

26:27 And seeing roller derby was created roller hockey. Yeah. Bobo Brazil, he'd be going, he'd be going, and then all of a sudden he'd get hit in the head. He had the headbutt, right? Didn't he have the big headbutt? Right, and then he'd stop, and he would just all of a sudden get all this energy.

26:39 And you'd be like, Go get him. So funny. Well, I mean, we're kind of coming to the end, but I did have a question. Sure. What excites you, I think, the most about the music industry and live events kind of moving into the next step? I mean, obviously we have technology. That's a huge part of events that didn't used to be, but you've also seen that change of technology being adapted.

27:01 So just across the board, it doesn't have to be technology. What excites you? Well, I'll tell you what, and maybe I'll turn this around a little bit. Okay. I'm not excited about AI songwriting. I got into an argument with a buddy of mine who was sending me, Hey, I can write a song for you on AI now.

27:24 I can write you a song. And I'm like, I have no interest in it. And it kind of pisses me off because it takes away the creativity, the actual feelings that are put into a song and a human writes because they feel the passion. They feel the joy. They feel the hurt. They write about that because it's something that they've done.

27:49 I'm concerned about AI getting into the music business as far as that goes. But look, there's a lot of other things that I'm sure that are going to be really creative with it in the process. I mean, there's been AI bands that I've heard and things like that that I kind of like, Okay, well, this is interesting.

28:10 But I guess because I'm an old fart in this business now and I've seen so much go through from 45s to 33s to cassettes. I do know what those are. Eight track cartridges to CDs and now streaming on Spotify and everything else. Radio is changing a bit. The industry is changing.

28:38 Live concerts cost a freaking fortune. Do they? To produce and go do. Well, exactly. I mean, it's tougher and tougher. I want to see some of the smaller venues continue. I love seeing one of my favorite events that I saw right after COVID was when COVID started loosening up. The Foo Fighters did a show at the Canyon Club in Agoura Hills,

29:06 which is a legendary concert venue. A thousand people. They have dinner and that. And it was a show that they did as a warm up for their tour. And they did a great job of making sure that people were vaccinated when they came in. You had to show your vax card and everything. And you didn't have to wear masks in there at the time or anything.

29:28 It was great to see great bands like that in smaller venues. Almost like a reverse. It's great to see that. When you're able to see some of those. They had Foreigner come out there and play an acoustic set not too long ago, which is really good. So I'm always a big proponent of small venues continuing.

29:51 And I'm hoping people will continue to support smaller venues and seeing shows on there and when these venues can get national talent to play. It's great. It's always a great experience to see it. And to me, that's the kind of thing that's worth the money to pay for. I love it. There you go.

30:10 Well, that's a great way to end. There you go. I like it. Smaller venues. We appreciate you, Tommy. We do. Great seeing you. David, it's a pleasure to see you. And Rachel, it's a pleasure to meet you. Great to meet you. I hope to meet you in person sometime when we come out to the Phoenix, Scottsdale area or something in the future.

30:26 Come on out. You can stay at the house and I'll just have liquor. That sounds great. We'll have liquor flowing for hours. I love it. You and I, we can hoist a few. I'm in. There you go. Great. Well, a pleasure being on here and all the best with your podcast. I'm sure it's going to be great.

30:43 Yeah, it's fun. Thank you so much. If you know anybody that you think would be fun on it, let us know. Yeah. You got it for sure. Thanks so much, Tommy. All right, Tommy. We'll see you soon. See you guys. Thanks for joining the event talk podcast, Hot Mikes, Cold Drinks and Untold Disasters with Tommy.

30:59 Phenomenal guests, amazing stories. We're so excited to continue the future of this podcast. So definitely keep tuning in. We'll see you next time. Thanks for tuning into the event talk podcast, Hot Mikes, Cold Drinks and Untold Disasters where every event has a story. A big thank you to our guests for their laughs, stories and lessons.

31:18 If you loved this episode, don't forget to subscribe, leave a review and share with your fellow event pros. Until next time.